**** BEGINNE LOGBUCH UM Tue Nov 5 18:40:02 2013 2013-11-05 18:40:02 * Du sprichst jetzt in #LGM2014 2013-11-05 18:51:45 * patdavid (~patdavid@69.85.233.202) hat #LGM2014 betreten 2013-11-05 18:56:31 well well right on time, rooms are reserved 2013-11-05 19:01:43 ready, steady, GO! 2013-11-05 19:02:23 pippin: jonnor-work2 wake up 2013-11-05 19:02:38 * patdavid looks around. 2013-11-05 19:02:44 *hits snooze button* 2013-11-05 19:02:58 oh, fine, I'm awake 2013-11-05 19:03:53 point 1 on the agenda has to be canceled: no cake tonight 2013-11-05 19:03:55 more worried about pippin, he is in Mañana Mañana land 2013-11-05 19:04:10 I got the room reservations, except for 2 rooms where the university wants to know from me if I can live with that they are not at the same level like the others 2013-11-05 19:04:43 are there lifts? 2013-11-05 19:05:16 yes 2013-11-05 19:05:43 then it should be ok i guess. every lgm i have been to had rooms across several floors 2013-11-05 19:05:43 I think we can live with that 2013-11-05 19:06:24 so well we have: SR 1 (I 119) for 70 ppl 2013-11-05 19:06:42 SR 5 (I 127) for 40 ppl 2013-11-05 19:06:48 * a-l-e (~quassel@72-77.195-178.cust.bluewin.ch) hat #LGM2014 betreten 2013-11-05 19:06:55 SR 7 (I 131) also 40 2013-11-05 19:07:08 SR 8 (I 132) for 30 2013-11-05 19:07:23 SR 12 (I 215) for 34 2013-11-05 19:07:42 this are all flexible with tables and chairs 2013-11-05 19:08:06 SR 13 (I 274) and this one is for 35 ppl but not flexible 2013-11-05 19:09:36 are I NNN buildings? 2013-11-05 19:09:42 the good thing is, that are rooms of the faculty of economics and they are in the neighbor building and there is passage from paulinum 2013-11-05 19:09:59 houz: can u translate that? 2013-11-05 19:10:17 (I 131) <-- what does that mean? 2013-11-05 19:10:29 "SR" should be seminar room i guess? 2013-11-05 19:10:49 that are the room numbers 2013-11-05 19:11:05 ok 2013-11-05 19:11:10 proceed :) 2013-11-05 19:11:22 * patdavid thanks houz for the clarification. 2013-11-05 19:11:57 so I 131 is 1st floor, I 215 is 2nd 2013-11-05 19:12:08 yeah houz u got it 2013-11-05 19:12:46 do these rooms have blackboard/whiteboard and projector? 2013-11-05 19:12:47 gnokii: sounds very good 2013-11-05 19:13:22 for the other two rooms, I have to answer some questions, but there will be two more so should be definitely be enough 2013-11-05 19:13:41 all are fully equipped, means projector 2013-11-05 19:13:52 awesome 2013-11-05 19:15:59 I put this information in http://lgm2014.titanpad.com/1 so that we have it (under "available spaces") 2013-11-05 19:16:25 jonnor-work2: awesome that was my intention 2013-11-05 19:17:08 gnokii: is there a central place near the entrance where everyone has to pass by so we can have a welcome booth? 2013-11-05 19:17:33 in brussels that was quite nice, a prepared pack of dead tree with all relevant information handed to every new arriver 2013-11-05 19:17:34 houz: thats one of the places, I still have to talk with the girl 2013-11-05 19:18:21 houz I thought on that ;) 2013-11-05 19:19:35 does anyone remember who was responsible for sponsor acquisition? 2013-11-05 19:19:50 global sponsors mostly louis. 2013-11-05 19:20:04 local sponsors, the local organizers... 2013-11-05 19:20:18 hust 2013-11-05 19:20:47 sponsorship = [Nathan,Sirko,Louis] Purpose: Secure money for the event. 2013-11-05 19:20:52 i am asking because i haven't received any reimbursement yet and wonder if there are problems with the money. it would be great if this would work next year for a change 2013-11-05 19:20:52 from http://lgm2013.titanpad.com/4 2013-11-05 19:20:54 +1 2013-11-05 19:21:32 problem is generally not with (getting) money, just the administitiva of getting it out to people 2013-11-05 19:21:50 jonnor-work2: that is a problem? 2013-11-05 19:21:54 the amount of money is probably ok. 2013-11-05 19:22:21 gnokii: yes, it has taken around 12 months to get reimbursed the last years 2013-11-05 19:23:32 there have been discussions in the past to collect enough money in an early stage to allow preimbursing some people before the event that really need the money to be able to buy the tickets. is that still planned? 2013-11-05 19:23:35 one of the problems is that it is seems to be more complex to send money from canada to europe than inside of europe... and our money happens to be in canada. 2013-11-05 19:23:55 houz,yes. From the goals on above pad - Have all travel money secured 3 months before the event. 2013-11-05 19:24:06 i welcome a discussion on how the finances are managed, but i'm not sure that it should be discussed in this meeting :-) 2013-11-05 19:24:20 a-l-e: people were asked to provide paypal accounts which many did i guess. that system should be relatively nation-agnostic 2013-11-05 19:24:28 well with paypal its no problem and most of the ppl have given there paypal, it might be a problem without as the Americans dont know what a bank transfer is an wiring money 2013-11-05 19:25:11 i don't want to push this today, but it's something that needs to be addressed soonish. 2013-11-05 19:25:45 it would be nice to have louis around for such a discussion, maybe he can shed some light on the problems he is facing 2013-11-05 19:25:46 fully agree that it should be addressed! 2013-11-05 19:26:00 yes, I suggest we move the money issue to another meeting 2013-11-05 19:26:00 especially since the people currently handling it is not present (Louis) 2013-11-05 19:26:00 if anyone has a proposal on how to improve the situation, I encourage you to present it and call in a meeting 2013-11-05 19:26:28 pippin: where are thou 2013-11-05 19:26:31 jonnor-work2: I think houz mentioned it, so that it is in the protocol ;) 2013-11-05 19:27:16 it would be easier to come up with ideas if there was some public budget, bills, any numbers so we knew what we are actually talking about 2013-11-05 19:27:43 anyway, that should probably be moved to the mailing list 2013-11-05 19:28:06 yes, that is something for the local team to think about / help with as well 2013-11-05 19:28:29 jonnor-work2: what u mean with that? 2013-11-05 19:29:03 imo, the main issue is that we need fresh/more/more active people taking care of the finances. 2013-11-05 19:29:06 gnokii: there are probably costs for some of the things the local team needs 2013-11-05 19:29:13 if so, we need to know what those costs are 2013-11-05 19:29:24 "we" as in the people who are not local 2013-11-05 19:29:25 if possible not people that are already busy with lot of other things (in the lgm and in the rest of their life) 2013-11-05 19:29:42 thats true but there was an well lets say agreement in Madrid, that travel and local costs are divided 2013-11-05 19:30:09 i.e., paid from different treasure chambers? 2013-11-05 19:32:29 since i don't hold any lgm chair yet i would volunteer to help with the financial stuff 2013-11-05 19:32:30 jonnor-work2: there are some costs, like name badges and stuff like that but thats not the big deal 2013-11-05 19:34:16 since i was not there last time, i wanted to ask if anybody shared my thoughts about: 2013-11-05 19:34:21 Martin wants also a byfinancing of the catering if possible 2013-11-05 19:34:42 - trying to better target our different publics (potentially with different offers) 2013-11-05 19:35:04 - avoiding the fatigue of "having to" take part to all lgm activities 2013-11-05 19:35:20 a-l-e: that wasn't discussed, let's talk about it now 2013-11-05 19:36:33 personally, i like the idea of a mixture of very different talks, somehow sorted by topics. but i notice that this is hard to "sell" 2013-11-05 19:36:53 many people don't get why they should come to the LGM. 2013-11-05 19:36:54 jonnor-work2: did u note that to the pad? since i don't hold any lgm chair yet i would volunteer to help with the financial stuff 2013-11-05 19:36:55 gnokii: ok. Fine by me 2013-11-05 19:37:15 i think that this applies also to some people who were at past lgm and did not come to the most recent ones. 2013-11-05 19:37:30 gnokii: y 2013-11-05 19:38:24 a-l-e: we discussed briefly the idea that pippin had, marking the different tracks. Also, a point was raised that we need to provide the program much earlier 2013-11-05 19:38:39 a lot of people dont even have that available when they decide to go/not go 2013-11-05 19:38:54 btw, i'm curious if it's appropriate for me to discuss any ideas around a workshop/photowalk focused on a f/oss workflow for photography? 2013-11-05 19:39:00 and add the group photo to the program. many people missed it this year 2013-11-05 19:39:01 or if i should hold that off? 2013-11-05 19:39:12 patdavid: count me in 2013-11-05 19:39:46 having not attended any lgm's previously, i didn't want to talk out of turn... 2013-11-05 19:41:25 patdavid: We will have a call for content, where you can register/propose workshops, presentations etc 2013-11-05 19:41:32 jonnor-work2: i don't know if parallel tracks are the solution... in the past lgms i had mostly the feeling that people were already bothered by the fact that multiple workshops were taking place in parallel. 2013-11-05 19:41:43 * patdavid thanks jonnor-work2 2013-11-05 19:41:45 a-l-e: i noticed that it's quite hard to motivate other developers to come to lgm. i didn't come up with ideas how to change that yet. do you have any? 2013-11-05 19:41:48 jonnor-work2: he questioned that alread last week in #lgm 2013-11-05 19:42:21 a-l-e: we have not decided on parallel tracks. pippins idea was jsust to have visual markings for attendees, and to make presenters a bit more concious about what/how they present 2013-11-05 19:42:34 parallel tracks are not the best idea, given that we don't suffer from too many talks 2013-11-05 19:42:47 houz: I think Marios idea with the GSoC students would address that, I questioned him last week how the plany are for that but have no answer et 2013-11-05 19:43:08 jonnor-work2: did pippin propose to mark tracks? i understood it as a measurement for individual talks 2013-11-05 19:43:18 gnokii: can you develop more about mario's idea? never heard of it... 2013-11-05 19:43:19 or at least to parallelize on different topic areas, to avoid overlap (dev vs. art for instance) 2013-11-05 19:43:19 houz: individual 2013-11-05 19:43:30 gsoc students? at least dartkable doesn't have any 2013-11-05 19:43:33 overlap is exactly what we want :) 2013-11-05 19:43:59 overlap in topics, but in time? 2013-11-05 19:44:07 houz: but thats not ur fault 2013-11-05 19:44:47 yes, better marking in what direction a track goes, may be a good idea. 2013-11-05 19:45:07 i meant, those interested in art-presentation tracks won't miss a presentation that might be run concurrently 2013-11-05 19:45:08 ok, about marios idea: 2013-11-05 19:45:14 personally, i don't want to hear anybody begging for pardon for being technical in his/her talk. 2013-11-05 19:45:30 houz: have you tried getting devs to LGM? If so, what are their arguments against? or why do you think they dont show? 2013-11-05 19:45:30 houz: no, probably not in time 2013-11-05 19:45:44 he mentioned that google has a budget for mentor-student meetings or something like that and that it would be possible to get money from that to bring gsoc students to lgm 2013-11-05 19:45:57 or, for being too artsy / conceptual 2013-11-05 19:46:22 as far i can tell, the biggest problem with (european) gsoc students is that they don't have holidays during the LGM. 2013-11-05 19:46:30 i tried it for darktable and the reactions where ranging from "lgm? what is that?" to "isn't that just artists and culture people? why should i go there?" 2013-11-05 19:46:34 or they have exams right afterwards. 2013-11-05 19:47:07 houz: yes, that remark about the darktable is good. i think that we should clearly state what the devs can get from the lgm. 2013-11-05 19:47:09 the only one i managed to lure there (he lives in madrid) just came for half a talk and then left together with me for some private developers talk in a bar 2013-11-05 19:47:21 houz: Scribus/GIMP/MyPaint/Inkscape devs are usually there. Isnt that enough of a counter-argument? 2013-11-05 19:47:34 well a-l-e we will not see any student at university Leipzig as there are holidays, maybe Leipzig isnt located in Europe 2013-11-05 19:47:34 well 2013-11-05 19:47:48 gnokii: no holidays or preparing exams 2013-11-05 19:48:02 many past talks are also available online, both artsy and techy 2013-11-05 19:48:18 this is the answer i got from most gsoc students i've got in touch during the last few years. 2013-11-05 19:48:33 we cant change who has holidays or not 2013-11-05 19:48:53 if the trip is sponsored and the offer enough ahead of time, perhaps some students will take a few days off 2013-11-05 19:49:01 the big problem with gsoc is that it might work for US and asian students but many european countries (including germany) have lecture time during gsoc so they can't attend 2013-11-05 19:49:05 thats the point 2013-11-05 19:49:07 2013-11-05 19:49:16 no, but we could place the lgm in a way that young people at universities and other high schools are likely to be able to attend. 2013-11-05 19:49:23 houz: is that an argument to not try it? 2013-11-05 19:49:59 jonnor-work2: it's just an explanation why many local students are not in gsoc. nothing else. i like the proposal to bring gsoc folks to lgm 2013-11-05 19:51:00 i like it too. i just notice that it's hard to get them to attend because of their school load. 2013-11-05 19:51:05 we've already placed LGM2014 I am afraid 2013-11-05 19:51:05 2015 is open 2013-11-05 19:51:09 so, what we seem to need is a plan how to address developers to come to lgm. i don't think that we need to get more attractive for the artsy folks, they already come 2013-11-05 19:51:35 it would be cool to have blender back 2013-11-05 19:51:51 houz: I arranged something for that 2013-11-05 19:51:51 (afaik, we never had blender in....) 2013-11-05 19:52:07 maybe with a workshop about the stuff leaned from tears of steel, life footage editing *hint* ^^ 2013-11-05 19:52:16 a-l-e: sure we had 2013-11-05 19:52:18 and i agree: we should be more attractive for developers. 2013-11-05 19:52:20 ton was in brussels 2013-11-05 19:52:25 Blender team, including Ton at Brussels 2013-11-05 19:52:28 well Ton personally was at LGM maybe he doing not Blender anymore 2013-11-05 19:52:42 well, we had people from blender attending in brussels. yes. 2013-11-05 19:52:43 the gave a sneak preview of sintel or bbb or some other movie 2013-11-05 19:52:56 +y 2013-11-05 19:53:00 I think we should post our Call for Contents on blendernation 2013-11-05 19:53:04 but as far i can recall they were not really active as a team at the lgm. 2013-11-05 19:53:11 they were more individual taking part. 2013-11-05 19:53:15 and perhaps invite Ton & team especially 2013-11-05 19:53:26 they gave talks, that's enough taking part for me 2013-11-05 19:53:38 well, not for me. 2013-11-05 19:53:45 a-l-e: yes, they were in the middle of making Sintel though - and half the team was still in Amsterdam doing that 2013-11-05 19:53:50 a-l-e: i am not sure what you mean 2013-11-05 19:53:50 i'd like them to be around and being visible. 2013-11-05 19:54:01 what kind of visible? :) 2013-11-05 19:54:08 like wearing funny blender-hats? 2013-11-05 19:54:18 BBB suit! 2013-11-05 19:54:21 +1 2013-11-05 19:54:58 anyway, does anyone have the slightest idea how to attract devs? gnokii, you said you had something? 2013-11-05 19:54:59 houz: see my line to blender above ;) 2013-11-05 19:55:06 I think we should aim to have at least one Blender workshop if we want to get them in though 2013-11-05 19:55:45 so that they are actively participating 2013-11-05 19:55:45 presentations are something, but only that can be a bit "shallow" 2013-11-05 19:55:51 jonnor-work2: I am a close friend to Gottfried Hofmann, he had a good talk at blender con few days ago, think will invite him ;) 2013-11-05 19:55:55 imo, the main question behind how to attract devs (and also the blender ones!) is to find out what can we offer them. 2013-11-05 19:55:56 that would be cool indeed. however, to get projects to participate i think we have to make sure (or at least help) that they as a project benefit from it somehow 2013-11-05 19:56:12 gnokii: cool 2013-11-05 19:56:20 a-l-e: exactly 2013-11-05 19:56:21 a-l-e: agreed completely 2013-11-05 19:56:35 until now we had: 2013-11-05 19:56:44 just giving them a room with chairs doesn't cut it 2013-11-05 19:56:46 - you can give a talk about your software 2013-11-05 19:56:53 - you can get in touch with other teams 2013-11-05 19:57:01 - you can get in touch inside your team 2013-11-05 19:57:07 - you can get in touch with your users. 2013-11-05 19:58:23 well all the things I can have on other events too 2013-11-05 19:58:27 gnokii: you said that you want to have one room as a catering area. could that be turned into a cozy hacker area? couches, dim light, lots of club mate and power + network so that you can sit together, probably with people from other projects, and hack around? 2013-11-05 19:58:28 it seems that for several devs, the contact with the people in their project and with the other projects' people is established and does not attract them anymore. 2013-11-05 19:59:14 the catering area will definitely not turned into something like that 2013-11-05 19:59:20 too bad :) 2013-11-05 19:59:27 it's still a good thing, but not important enough to get some holidays for it. 2013-11-05 20:00:08 it might change when, ppl can be sure that they get reimbursed not 12 months later or never 2013-11-05 20:00:10 and the other points seem also to have gotten less interesting for the devs. 2013-11-05 20:00:19 i wonder if we have to stress the "you get the travel costs back" more? at least for small projects that don't have the funding as gimp has that's an important thing 2013-11-05 20:00:44 Personally, I think that a lot of people that were traditionally doing a lot of LG have just moved on to other things 2013-11-05 20:00:47 mmm... it may help, yes. some people might prefer it. 2013-11-05 20:01:07 jonnor-work2: but others filled the gaps i guess 2013-11-05 20:01:10 jonnor-work2: some like rejon yes 2013-11-05 20:01:11 but i think that the money is not the main issue. at least not for the devs in western europe. 2013-11-05 20:01:27 jonnor-work2: but there place is filled with new ones 2013-11-05 20:01:40 a-l-e: don't tell anyone, but i earn ~500-600 euros per month. it's an issue for me 2013-11-05 20:02:25 gnokii: many old GIMP devs are mostly inactive (mitch is notable exception) 2013-11-05 20:02:47 jonnor-work2: yeah but participation of GIMP isnt bad or? 2013-11-05 20:02:50 Martin from MyPaint is more into digital manufaturing these days 2013-11-05 20:02:53 I'm more doing embedded SW... 2013-11-05 20:03:05 jonnor-work2: btw I wanted to invite the dopey guy 2013-11-05 20:03:06 gnokii: no, GIMP team is actually very good in general 2013-11-05 20:03:32 jonnor-work2: might be a little bit that they are indepentend with the money ;) 2013-11-05 20:03:44 houz: money can be an issue. the way the reimboursement works is imo a bigger issue (promises that are fullfilled too late)... 2013-11-05 20:03:53 but i think that the main issues are not there. 2013-11-05 20:04:10 the thing what i like about lgm is that it's not only a conference where i attend talks and learn stuff (which gets less important every year) but it's also a family meeting 2013-11-05 20:04:24 maybe we have to build on that "meet the friends" feeling 2013-11-05 20:05:03 i don't know. personally, i'd like some workshop or talks for developers. 2013-11-05 20:05:14 sure, totally agreed 2013-11-05 20:05:16 gnokii: yes, and that they are quite social 2013-11-05 20:05:31 but i also like the social stuff, having dinner together, talking, ... 2013-11-05 20:05:41 i don't know, somebody presenting c++11 ... or pypy or multithreading... 2013-11-05 20:05:50 something challenging for the devs. 2013-11-05 20:05:56 in form of talks or workshops. 2013-11-05 20:06:18 that would be great. we talked about that last time, too 2013-11-05 20:06:47 it's interesting to hear what the users or artists think of your software, but after a few times you've heard enough of it. 2013-11-05 20:06:50 i wonder if we should put the logs of these meetings online, too? in case some subtleties or minor points didn't make it into the minutes? 2013-11-05 20:06:58 a-l-e: +2 2013-11-05 20:07:04 I hope to present multithreading, and many other perf. techniques 2013-11-05 20:07:24 wonderful! 2013-11-05 20:07:27 houz: yes we should :) If nothing else then for transparency 2013-11-05 20:07:52 ok, i will do so later 2013-11-05 20:07:59 I'm actually at work so I'm only picking up the major points in the notes 2013-11-05 20:08:10 but i think it would be nice to have also some "big names" in software development presenting specific topics. 2013-11-05 20:08:23 pippin: that's you ^ 2013-11-05 20:08:25 :) 2013-11-05 20:08:59 a-l-e: but also "lessons learned" when a project found out that something didn't work 2013-11-05 20:09:21 yep houz 2013-11-05 20:09:53 so it seems there is some consensus that lgm should try to move a little closer to devs again? 2013-11-05 20:10:08 i didn't say "away from artists" 2013-11-05 20:10:20 one thing I keep thinking about is, should we really try so hard to "revitalize" things - or focus on getting in and involving projects which are more "alive" these days? 2013-11-05 20:10:34 one thing that we also have discussed when leaving madrid, was to make the different groups / teams more visible... 2013-11-05 20:10:42 ... some would suggest bunny hats... 2013-11-05 20:10:44 jonnor-work2: what do you mean with revitalizing? 2013-11-05 20:11:15 houz: trying to boost/energize existing teams/projects 2013-11-05 20:11:25 a-l-e: the colored buttons from brussels with the logos were nice. small, you could wear as many as projects you are involved in, ... 2013-11-05 20:11:59 jonnor-work2: i don't think we should revive zombies, but at least blender is very alive and someone who might bring in technical expertise, too 2013-11-05 20:12:13 but reaching out to "new" projects would be worthwile, too 2013-11-05 20:12:19 those were nice indeed! but we were rather thinking of some sort flags/banner a group would put in front of them when sitting at a table... 2013-11-05 20:12:46 a-l-e: i am not sure that would work 2013-11-05 20:12:50 houz: https://fedoraproject.org/w/uploads/c/ca/Sxsw-badge-stickers-photo.jpg 2013-11-05 20:13:26 something likes this would be the luxus version of it: http://www.tidelinedesign.com/outdoor-products/feather-outdoor-flag-banner-00.jpg 2013-11-05 20:13:30 it might be good for semi official developer meetings so others could join if they think it's interesting to them. but in general? poeple mix up all the time, i don't think it would work 2013-11-05 20:13:50 gnokii: yes, similar to these 2013-11-05 20:13:59 but not as stickers 2013-11-05 20:14:07 I know as buttons 2013-11-05 20:14:08 well, what i notice is that new people have a hard time mixing in.... 2013-11-05 20:14:16 a-l-e: true 2013-11-05 20:14:22 houz: that can be done, depending on the budget 2013-11-05 20:15:27 have there been panels with devs from different projects in the past? 2013-11-05 20:15:48 where the audience can field questions about the project to them? 2013-11-05 20:15:49 a-l-e: what i noticed is that once you discussed with people in a workshop (or in a restaurant) it's easier to approach them and start to mix 2013-11-05 20:16:03 patdavid: only gimp IIRC 2013-11-05 20:16:24 perhaps something more like that, and a mixer would break the ice for newbies? 2013-11-05 20:16:50 panels could be nice, with open discussion with the audience 2013-11-05 20:17:27 houz: yep, for sure. also once somebody has introduced a person to a group, then they start to talk, not only with the people you have introduced them to. 2013-11-05 20:17:28 gnokii: are there plans to revive the lgm dinner? 2013-11-05 20:17:45 nope, there are some plans for social event 2013-11-05 20:18:12 a social mixer would produce a low-stress environment to approach others, might encourage discussions a bit better 2013-11-05 20:18:34 the dinner has always been at the first evening so people that meet there have time to make use of the newly acquired social confidence 2013-11-05 20:18:52 but if you're new - dinner the first night might be intimidating 2013-11-05 20:19:06 patdavid: it's not candle light ^^ 2013-11-05 20:19:08 especially if you haven't had a chance yet in the day to approach people you are interested in speaking with... 2013-11-05 20:19:33 what i mean is, ideas and questions sometimes develop over the course of more formal presentations/meetings 2013-11-05 20:19:33 houz: see that problem with "dinner" 2013-11-05 20:19:59 and may take a day or two to find an opportunity to approach someone (thinking of new ppl here of course - or outsiders) 2013-11-05 20:20:00 its quite informal 2013-11-05 20:20:16 maybe the catering area can help. the one in brussels was cool (the one under the roof) 2013-11-05 20:20:37 "dinner" just describes the time slot (evening) 2013-11-05 20:20:54 well except of sponsored beer there is not done a lot to that topic 2013-11-05 20:21:31 houz: a dinner is sitting on the table, not favored version of an social event ;) 2013-11-05 20:21:42 Regarding getting devs to take part. I propose that people write down the people/projects they want present in the pad 2013-11-05 20:21:46 gnokii: it's not so much about what you have, but that it's a space where people actually go when not attending talks/workshops, sit together and be social. instead of going to town shopping 2013-11-05 20:21:48 http://lgm2014.titanpad.com/1? 2013-11-05 20:21:51 now ;) 2013-11-05 20:22:48 houz: I thought u attended last meeting where I said there will be a catering area all the time for meeting, stting together and socialising ;) 2013-11-05 20:23:02 that's what i refered to 2013-11-05 20:23:26 we just have to make sure (advertising, cozy atmosphere, ...) that people actually be there 2013-11-05 20:24:18 houz: u will be there so far as I know u after I cashed in money ;) 2013-11-05 20:24:19 i don't if -- having experienced how geeks "work" -- it would be a good idea to have sort of online platform for people at the lgm. 2013-11-05 20:24:37 in wroclaw we had a very active irc channel during the lgm. 2013-11-05 20:25:05 a-l-e: are you saying it would be good or bad to have an irc channel? 2013-11-05 20:25:08 online platform? 2013-11-05 20:25:18 we already have #lgm 2013-11-05 20:25:26 which gets used during lgm 2013-11-05 20:25:40 we could definetely promote it more 2013-11-05 20:25:40 "we" seem to be more comfortable when typing at a keyboard than when talking in person... so "we" could need an ice breaker. 2013-11-05 20:25:49 on the other hand, perhaps people would prefer to use twitter... 2013-11-05 20:26:06 a-l-e: now i understand, the flaky wifi in madrid was planned ^^ 2013-11-05 20:26:09 platform in the widest sense: twitter, irc, ... 2013-11-05 20:26:25 having #lgm2014 or so as an official hashtag might help that though 2013-11-05 20:26:30 some like to live-tweet talks etc 2013-11-05 20:26:49 yep, somethign like an hashtag where all communication and chat happens... 2013-11-05 20:26:55 and that people know that it's there. 2013-11-05 20:27:04 of course, this only works if the wifi is working well! 2013-11-05 20:27:38 and power outlets everywhere ... 2013-11-05 20:27:58 but that's detail planning we don't have to think about now 2013-11-05 20:27:59 or if O2 sells prepaid sims by the door :p 2013-11-05 20:28:15 jonnor-work2: not necessary 2013-11-05 20:28:50 Leipzig has wifi in the whole inner city, u can use it without payment for 30min a day 2013-11-05 20:29:17 and the network from freifunk is also available 2013-11-05 20:29:58 can we use the university network, too? to not be dependant on 3rd parties? 2013-11-05 20:30:15 we've got 9 projects on the pad that we want present 2013-11-05 20:30:15 noone got more? 2013-11-05 20:30:43 we need university network.. 2013-11-05 20:30:49 i added one more 2013-11-05 20:31:45 .... which pad? 2013-11-05 20:31:49 jonnor-work2: of course the university has network and there is also wifi 2013-11-05 20:31:50 http://lgm2014.titanpad.com/1? 2013-11-05 20:31:53 a-l-e: ^ 2013-11-05 20:32:01 ~line 130 2013-11-05 20:32:03 I put it under "notes for 5 nov" 2013-11-05 20:32:07 ok, ... i don't see the project, then :-) 2013-11-05 20:32:16 ah, ok! 2013-11-05 20:33:24 is there already a claim for next lgm? 2013-11-05 20:33:46 houz: yes istanbul because its not europe :D 2013-11-05 20:33:57 gnokii: ? 2013-11-05 20:34:34 next lgm is in leipzig, and i want to know if we have a claim or slogan 2013-11-05 20:34:51 oh, a tagline 2013-11-05 20:35:24 houz: so slogan, yes Mario and me thought about "Join The Revolution" as it fits very well to Leipzig 2013-11-05 20:35:58 brussels had "reclaim your tools", no idea if we had a slogan after that 2013-11-05 20:37:16 one thing that i would like to see an emphasis on (especially seeing all these projects in the pad) is to push forward the interoperability between programs. i would think that this is something that could interest other devs, too, and that could benefit from face-to-face communication 2013-11-05 20:37:44 houz: madrid was "future tools" 2013-11-05 20:38:04 ah, right 2013-11-05 20:38:48 lgm 2014: together we stand :) 2013-11-05 20:39:03 woot 2013-11-05 20:39:09 or "united we stand" 2013-11-05 20:40:26 from wikipedia: ""United we stand, divided we fall" is a phrase that has been used in mottos, from nations and states to songs. The basic concept is that unless the people are united, it is easy to destroy them. It is often in the abbreviated form United we stand." 2013-11-05 20:40:30 "death to the digital divide" 2013-11-05 20:41:53 houz: I stick with join the revolution as we are the people makes no sense to the englishman 2013-11-05 20:41:56 we had a slogan in madrid and montreal, too. 2013-11-05 20:42:43 gnokii: just saying 2013-11-05 20:43:23 a-l-e: maybe we should have a "history" page listing all past lgms with their slogans and a link to the website. 2013-11-05 20:43:48 http://libregraphicsmeeting.org/lgm/?page_id=4 2013-11-05 20:44:17 btw, if anybody has a new server where we can host the lgm.org site i don't have any issues with moving it! 2013-11-05 20:44:17 is that linked from anywhere? 2013-11-05 20:44:42 it's the general site about the lgm. 2013-11-05 20:44:43 how much traffic does the site generate? 2013-11-05 20:44:49 houz: did u remember what i showed u today? 2013-11-05 20:45:02 gnokii: yes, post the link here please 2013-11-05 20:45:04 i don't think that it generates lot of traffic. 2013-11-05 20:45:06 * houz liked it 2013-11-05 20:45:23 at least not outside of the lgm month 2013-11-05 20:45:36 yeah but Robert has not finished the work yet, and he is on holiday 2013-11-05 20:46:02 http://img.susepaste.org/dfd2a417 2013-11-05 20:47:15 what font is lgm using? osp din? 2013-11-05 20:47:16 as someone looking from the outside, i'd find it helpful to have a specific page per LGM 2013-11-05 20:47:30 ^^ 2013-11-05 20:47:31 we do have that /$YEAR 2013-11-05 20:47:33 patdavid: we have that 2013-11-05 20:47:34 including a synopsis of the events that took place, and a nice set of links to all videos/presentation data 2013-11-05 20:47:55 i noticed that there is a page/LGM 2013-11-05 20:47:56 http://libregraphicsmeeting.org/2013 2013-11-05 20:48:04 but each page is structured differently from the last 2013-11-05 20:48:43 btw, i don't mind helping with building these pages when i have time (code or design) 2013-11-05 20:48:44 differently how? they are nearly identical to me... 2013-11-05 20:48:54 look at 2009 vs 2010 2013-11-05 20:48:55 yes, some centralized page collecting or linking the data from the year-sites could be added 2013-11-05 20:49:11 2009 has a neat overview of what happened right away 2013-11-05 20:49:40 2010 doesn't really have a nice list (or highlights) of what transpired 2013-11-05 20:49:42 and it mentions blender as a project ^^ 2013-11-05 20:49:46 yes, in 2009 we did not have the same 2013-11-05 20:49:46 but every year since 2013-11-05 20:50:12 sure, i just think a nicer format would make it more friendly to navigate content better 2013-11-05 20:50:53 perhaps a blurb about the focus/theme of the year, a paragraph of notable happenings, and a nice list of events that transpired, all linked to appropriate material 2013-11-05 20:50:54 well there is working somebody on that 2013-11-05 20:50:55 no, thats just because noone made it :) 2013-11-05 20:50:55 those whod like to volunteer for web-working should talk to a-l-e to get access 2013-11-05 20:51:10 exactly jonnor-work2 2013-11-05 20:51:16 gnokii: who is working on what? 2013-11-05 20:51:28 but i think i will create an account for everybody in the content group. 2013-11-05 20:51:43 jonnor-work2: a guy named Robert ;) 2013-11-05 20:51:45 ... as soon as i have some time. i'm currently moving... and have a bit too little time. 2013-11-05 20:52:39 gnokii: is working on... freshing up the website theme? 2013-11-05 20:52:47 jonnor-work2: yes 2013-11-05 20:53:02 good 2013-11-05 20:53:30 jonnor-work2: see the image gnokii linked to a few minutes ago 2013-11-05 20:53:40 jonnor-work2: we do our work, I also have prepared the content already, had some questions for Femke, becuase wanted to have a group photo 2013-11-05 20:53:42 gnokii: do you want a new theme for this year's lgm? 2013-11-05 20:53:51 a-l-e: yes 2013-11-05 20:54:04 ok, nice to know it! 2013-11-05 20:54:29 and do you have somebody who can implement it for wordpress? 2013-11-05 20:54:29 for instance, i cannot quickly find a neat list of all the topics presented that is easily grokked 2013-11-05 20:54:33 the one from the last years never worked for me on small screens like notebooks 2013-11-05 20:54:39 yes I have 2013-11-05 20:54:40 i always got 2 scroll bars 2013-11-05 20:55:00 gnokii: ok. Will you send the questions on the list? 2013-11-05 20:55:29 its just the group photo never have seen it, would be nice to have it on the pages 2013-11-05 20:56:02 gnokii: what about putting the photo on the pages? and if you don't have an account requesting one? 2013-11-05 20:56:08 what group photo? 2013-11-05 20:56:23 THE group photo? 2013-11-05 20:56:36 the group photo yes 2013-11-05 20:56:46 patdavid: there is a repository for the 2014 site... 2013-11-05 20:56:48 https://github.com/aoloe/lgm-wp-14 2013-11-05 20:56:56 it's still empty, since there is not much in there. 2013-11-05 20:57:16 but you can open tickets if you have ideas to improve the site. 2013-11-05 20:57:26 a-l-e: wordpress is the cms? 2013-11-05 20:57:46 shall we postpone the website discussion for now? or is that the only topic left open for tonight? 2013-11-05 20:58:04 patdavid: yes 2013-11-05 20:58:09 ty 2013-11-05 20:58:16 patdavid: what u want to do? 2013-11-05 20:58:36 gnokii: can you get the person(s) working on the new theme to get in touch with me? 2013-11-05 20:58:47 i didn't want to do anything in particular, i was just opining about usability of the site, and offering to help where i could with desing/code... 2013-11-05 20:58:59 sure, when Robert is back from holiday 2013-11-05 20:59:05 s/desing/design/ 2013-11-05 20:59:38 so the upcoming one? 2013-11-05 21:00:06 I need to go home soon. pippin and I have worked a bit (mostly pippin) on the call-for-content proposal. I hope we can send it to the list before a next meeting 2013-11-05 21:00:22 jonnor-work2: do u see pippin ? 2013-11-05 21:00:55 gnokii: no, not now. We chat on jabber from time to time 2013-11-05 21:01:15 He is travelling, often without internet 2013-11-05 21:01:15 yeah want to speak with him wanted to plan a little bit the color-table 2013-11-05 21:01:40 color table? 2013-11-05 21:02:05 yeah houz there is an second event planned arround lgm 2013-11-05 21:02:08 patdavid: yes we are working with wordpress 2013-11-05 21:02:29 ok 2013-11-05 21:02:54 color table as in color management event? 2013-11-05 21:03:14 ok, i have to leave soon. 2013-11-05 21:03:58 * pippin suddenly appears 2013-11-05 21:04:09 jonnor-work2: yes 2013-11-05 21:04:22 let's make a new date before everyone runs away. or shall we do that on the list? 2013-11-05 21:04:24 pippin: hey 2013-11-05 21:04:27 a pippin 2013-11-05 21:04:42 hey pippin 2013-11-05 21:04:45 (currently in vaillage up in the andes) 2013-11-05 21:04:51 s/vaillage/village/ 2013-11-05 21:05:12 I need to go too, so I am in favor of continuing in a new meeting 2013-11-05 21:05:12 I also think we need to get more concrete input on the cfp before it can bear much fruit anyway 2013-11-05 21:05:35 would be a week ok? 2013-11-05 21:05:55 let's decide on the date on the list. i am sure we want femke in, too 2013-11-05 21:06:19 one core theme I am pushing for in the current draft is overlap developer/artist and if any focus; I'd like focus on things that brings people across that divide (in both directions) 2013-11-05 21:06:53 pippin: whens the chance to get you to talk about the cm even at lgm? 2013-11-05 21:07:31 pippin: another thing i'd like to see (and that might lure some devs to lgm) is working on interoperability between different applications 2013-11-05 21:07:53 gnokii: same time next week would be OK with me. Tuesday 12th November, 19.00 CET ? 2013-11-05 21:08:28 jonnor-work2: I am ok with that, lets post it to the list we will see if Femke can or not can attend 2013-11-05 21:08:29 * pippin is travelling lima->sao paulo in a horirble 24h span around that time 2013-11-05 21:08:46 pippin: hmm, then we should try something e 2013-11-05 21:08:54 pippin: should we move to wednesday then? 2013-11-05 21:09:02 or even further into the future? 2013-11-05 21:09:24 wednesday not a good idea, alread have meeting there 2013-11-05 21:09:28 Wednesday is no-go for me 2013-11-05 21:09:50 Saturday 9th too soon? 2013-11-05 21:10:14 * houz is not online on 9th 2013-11-05 21:10:33 would not work for me, will be at an event this weekend have one talk and one workshop to present 2013-11-05 21:10:45 Monday 11? pippin , gnokii ? 2013-11-05 21:10:57 not the best for me, but I can make it work 2013-11-05 21:11:00 that would be possible 2013-11-05 21:11:19 a-l-e: ? 2013-11-05 21:12:01 no, monday 11th i'm busy the whole evening 2013-11-05 21:12:28 :( 2013-11-05 21:12:32 tue i may have something. wed is still free 2013-11-05 21:12:38 st. martin's parade on 11th over here 2013-11-05 21:15:16 Sunday 10, evening ? 2013-11-05 21:15:16 gnokii: ? 2013-11-05 21:15:34 jonnor-work2: nope will travelling home there 2013-11-05 21:15:34 if not someone else will have to suggest something 2013-11-05 21:15:41 sunday 6-8 would be possible for me. 2013-11-05 21:17:50 14th? 2013-11-05 21:17:52 let's ask on the list. or start a doodle 2013-11-05 21:18:13 14th would work for me 2013-11-05 21:18:30 pippin: jonnor-work2 ? 2013-11-05 21:18:46 14th is no-go. Friday 15 early could work 2013-11-05 21:18:55 I think doodle... 2013-11-05 21:19:09 ok then do one 2013-11-05 21:19:22 15th would be also fine to me 2013-11-05 21:19:54 do we have a definition of what we understand as "graphics"? images? video? animations? everything visual? 2013-11-05 21:20:15 anything visual 2013-11-05 21:20:33 agree on anything visual. 2013-11-05 21:20:55 cool, thanks 2013-11-05 21:33:13 gah 2013-11-05 21:33:17 does someone have the full log? 2013-11-05 21:33:45 houz: did you say you will send irc log to list? 2013-11-05 21:36:10 pippin: have you got the IRC log? 2013-11-05 21:37:14 gotta run 2013-11-05 21:37:18 someone please send log to list 2013-11-05 21:38:32 i will 2013-11-05 21:40:33 thanks! 2013-11-05 21:40:34 later 2013-11-05 21:41:16 * jonnor-work2 (~jonnor-wo@80.241.81.102) hat die Verbindung getrennt (Quit: jonnor-work2) 2013-11-05 21:41:18 dont think full log is necessary 2013-11-05 21:49:05 i will post it nevertheless for documentation purposes 2013-11-05 21:58:00 good night 2013-11-05 22:01:04 nites a-l-e 2013-11-05 22:02:26 * a-l-e (~quassel@72-77.195-178.cust.bluewin.ch) hat die Verbindung getrennt (Ping timeout: 245 seconds)